Anyone out there using SureCal? If so, are you using E-Prom sensors?
Using E-PROM Sensors As Standards? That I don't know.. Most labs use the 848x Sensors for standard or the Tegam Bolometers.
SureCal is able to program the EPROMs for the Sensors it calibrates for the most part. They don't calibrate the linearity or support the B-Series EPROM based power sensors.
Currently PS-Cal http://www.callabsolutions.com/ps-cal/ is the most complete solution for calibrating power sensors. It does the required linearity tests, rise time test and other required checks per the manufacture's requirements. And supports over 190 power sensors models as well as Tegam Bolometers.
PS-CAL will also allow you to use E-PROM Base power sensors as the traceable standard, but your uncertainties will go up. One of the problems is the EPROM's can not hold enough frequency points or the reflection data required to better compute the Cal Factor. For best accuracies you should use a data file instead of the data in the EPROM.
Can I ask, what are you trying to accomplish?
MIke
The programs call out for older type sensors ex: 8481A ect. ( depending on range of the sig gen) for checking frequency response on generators. My question is can these be used by changing the dat files to percent or are we stuck using what is called for in the procedure. We have e9304-H18 that go from 9 kHz to 18 GHz. So on some signal generators we would only need one sensor.
We do use SureCAL for calibrating some of the E-Prom sensors.
I believe the Keysight N8480 series would be E-Prom and have H84 as an available calibration option. I saw a reference somewhere to an E9304A H84 as well but I do rrecall several years ago I checked & at that time it wasn't an option.
H84 is Keysights Standards Lab cal with smaller uncertainties for those unfamiliar
You can use the E9304A, just make sure the dat file has the same setup as the old power sensor cal factors.
The problem you have with the E9304 Power sensors is measurements / traceability below 100kHz. Below that you need to make a voltage measurement.
For best accuracies, PS-Cal preforms those test with a Fluke 5790A.
Mike.
Sure Cal does a math calculation using a data file. The percentages are then added or subtracted to readings based on the frequency point. The cal factor is placed at 100% 50 MHz , which is the calibration point ( ref) @ 50 MHz. Has anyone tried using the E-prom type sensors with sure cal by putting the cal factor at 100 % and making the data file in percentage?
If you can read your eprom sensor and create a .DAT file from it, you should be able to run at any 50M corrections, not just 100% (100%,98%,etc.to 85%). Also you should be able to use that DAT file when SC asks for it. As long as the sensor you selected has the same freq range as the corrections.
Hope this helps
Not with Agilent EPROM Sensors.. The (50MHz) Ref Cal Factor is set to 100% ALL THE TIME.
Quote from: CalLabSolutions on 11-11-2015 -- 17:20:49
Not with Agilent EPROM Sensors.. The (50MHz) Ref Cal Factor is set to 100% ALL THE TIME.
Only for the high range.
*edit - oh, with surecal, sure. It does all of the correcting in the software. I thought you meant the values that are burned to the eeprom. There are 2 separate 50 MHz ref points for High and Low 'ranges'. While I haven't seen any with both set to 100%, that doesn't mean there aren't any, but I think it is unlikely.
Quote from: CalLabSolutions on 09-23-2015 -- 14:09:44
SureCal is able to program the EPROMs for the Sensors it calibrates for the most part. They don't calibrate the linearity or support the B-Series EPROM based power sensors.
Surecal does linearity, at 50 MHz, using a step two programmable step attenuators, Keysight 84xx series with interconnect kit and a 11713x driver
SureCal doing linearity is news too me. But I don't thing using attenuators is accurate enough. On an E4412A 7 13A you have to go from -36 to +23 at better than 1% accuracy. On the newer N848xA Sensors you have to be better that .25%. I don't think you can do that with a set of step attenuators.
Mike
P.S. Then you have to program the EEPROM because on the E441xA Sensors, it is adjustable.
Quote from: CalLabSolutions on 11-12-2015 -- 09:26:07
But I don't thing using attenuators is accurate enough.
That's how Keysight does it using TME and SureCal has had that ability for years iirc. Whether or not it was/is being used is another story.
J,
TME is not using the Attenuators as the traceable standards, what they have done is built you a dynamic accuracy test set and they are using the linearity of the power sensor over 10 dB of its square law region, (i.e. its sweat spot). Then with each 10dB step the set a new reference and do it again.
SureCal, I don't know, never ran their software.
Mike.
Side Note: This methodology comes from calibrating the dynamic accuracy of Vector Network Analyzer or scale fidelity of a PSA when no attenuator measured with a VNA is accurate enough. Keysight's new methodology phase shifts to 50MHz signals for even greater accuracy.
Quote from: CalLabSolutions on 11-12-2015 -- 09:26:07
SureCal doing linearity is news too me. But I don't thing using attenuators is accurate enough. On an E4412A 7 13A you have to go from -36 to +23 at better than 1% accuracy. On the newer N848xA Sensors you have to be better that .25%. I don't think you can do that with a set of step attenuators.
Mike
Mike, actually not so hard as we are talking incremental attenuation not absolute, this is pretty much routine
Frequency S2,1 S2,1
(MHz) Mag (dB) U(Mag) (dB)
Incremental (0 to 50) 50 -50.053 0.006
Absolute (with Insertion loss) 50 -50.136 0.037
P.S. Then you have to program the EEPROM because on the E441xA Sensors, it is adjustable.
Quote from: mlangfield on 09-23-2015 -- 08:03:22
Anyone out there using SureCal? If so, are you using E-Prom sensors?
I am assuming that you mean as a standard in order to calibrate another unit.
There is good news and bad news. Some of the SureCal Procedures are written to leverage the E-Sensors and work great.
But that is not always the case. In older Procedures, you will need a data file in order to use an E-Sensor, and that becomes a problem if the power level you are measuring is used both above and below -13 dBm. The E-Sensor switches ranges in that region, and the cal factor changes accordingly. There is no current methodology to have a level and frequency sensitive sersor correction file, so it will be inaccurate in either the low or high range (depending on which range you opted to use as your data source).
Exactly Kevin.
Ryan, I don't using an older procedure would be a problem as you could use two separate files for the proper cal factors.